11th November

[Dave]

Today I found myself in a minority on two counts.
I paused for two minutes in quiet reflection at 11.00 on 11/11/2006 when I realised that the world was carrying on as normal. The memory thudded home that not since I was a child had everyone paused ( even the buses pulled up in those days) to observe the silence to allow contemplation of the horrors of war.
I also noticed that I was one of the few not wearing a poppy - a concious decision on my part as I have not worn a poppy since Blair represented this country at the Cenotaph and will not do so until he and his kind (of any party) are consigned to the dustbin of history (it'll be a long wait, I imagine). Don't get me wrong - I contribute to the Haig Fund every year if only on the basis that if I can spend �12 plus on a good wine then the same amount of money is okay in the box whether I wear the poppy or not ( but it does go deeper than that). And ....... I remember.
Tomorrow, give a little thought at 11.00 no matter what you are doing - two minutes can seem a lifetime ....... for some it was two seconds and that was their lifetime.
And not just for the service people who died - for the civilians too. In any war scenario they are a casualty list for no reason other than they were in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Any contempt should be for the politicians of any creed as no military person ever started a war .... they only finish it. There is no such thing as "courageous politicians", they only trade in the courage of others. And the terror of innocents.
If you haven't put a few shillings in the collecting tin, may I ask you to do so. It will help someone, somewhere.
Thank you for reading this - and regardless of your beliefs, a few pence will help some poor sod somewhere who has a worse time of it than us!
Tomorrow, if you see the Cenotaph ceremony on t.v. or listen to it on the radio, just listen to the Last Post from the R.M. Buglers - and after the overwhelming sensation of sadness just remember to ask yourself - "Why" ?
The war of 1914-1918 was supposed to be "the war to end all wars" - where did humanity go wrong ! Put some money in the boxes, people - and be thankful that someone else does the dirty work and pays the price.

[Ozzie Geoff]

Very well said, Dave.
I paused what I was doing and stood in silent contemplation for 2 minutes. I turned the radio off as no station that I know of played The Last Post and observed the silence, sad, eh?
I do know that when the 11th occurs on a weekday there is a bugler at every major intersection in the city. A policeman stops all traffic and all pedestrians pause and God help anyone who keeps walking..they are soon pulled into line.
I wonder how long that tradition will last?
And that rot about white poppies..Gawd help us.

[Joanie]

Well said Dave i usually go to the cenotaph but i'm not very well at present,so i watched it on tv.My late husband used to put his medals on,and very proudly lay a wreath for the Merchant Navy.He was in the Russian convoys and they shipped all the supplies over he was only 15 at the time,he must have been terrified a lot of men died there.he was very proud of his white beret and his medals

[JuliaB]

We went to a service of remembrance today as we were up in the Lake District visiting my mother who she is a regular church attender. There were buglers from the Sea Cadets who sounded the Last Post and at the end of the service all those present were invited to file past the war memorial and leave their poppies there. It was a touching moment and I'm glad we were able to take part. We must not forget.

[Sandra]

We were in our local Sainsbury's on Saturday morning and at 10.50 and 10.55 it was announced that the two minute silence would be observed at 11.00am. When 11.00am arrived everthing and everyone stopped what they were doing, you could have heard a pin drop. It was a very special and moving two minutes. I too remember a time when everyone stood still wherever they were and the buses pulled over.

[robinbristol]

I remember the first time when I was a youngster, even the rag and bone man would not let his horse drink from the trough in those two minutes. Aah the gold old days.

[Dave]

Aaaah! Joannie.
Your late husband was a Russian Convoy man ? Now there was a recognition which was a long time coming !
Having worked, trained and practised warfare up inside the Arctic Circle I still cannot imagine the privations and horrors that would have occurred duringt those convoys, even having read the stories - especially to a 15 year old. Both sides of the warfare can attest to that - but the convoy men ? A different world than the one we can imagine.
My respect for him and his colleagues - especially as a merchantman who could only watch and wait - cannot be measured.
It is a time that I can only be grateful not to have experienced.
Good wishes and happy memories, Joannie

[Joanie]

Thank you Dave

[CalumLincoln]

Dave

I've been lurking on this board (and the Symi Visitor site) since our visit to the island last summer. Your message though brought back some memories passed down by my father and I thought I post my first message.

During WW2 my family, who lived in a small Scottish port, used to board sailors who had come back for some leave after being on the Russian convoy patrols. One Geordie lad became a firm favourite with my grandmother as he had no family of his own and she treated him like her son. In fact, my father always said he was like a brother. They were the same age, 18 or 19 years old.

He had stayed with my grandmother a good few times over the years of his convoy trips but both my grandmother and father began to notice differences in him each time he came back. On his last visit which was for three days he never slept and paced the floor constantly with my dad at his side. He said when he left the next day that he wouldn't be back. Sadly he was right, his ship was sunk and he didn't survive. It broke my grandmother's heart.

I never knew him although I grew up listening to my dad talk fondly about him and every November it is that lost sailor I think about. So many years have passed since my father died and I don't have the lad's name or even the name of the ship and I regret that very much. I'd love to find out more about the boy that made my grandmother think of him as her own.

Regards,

Calum

[Ozzie Geoff]

Thankyou for sharing that story with us, Calum.
Sadly there are probably many along the same vein. At least your family can be comforted by the fact that you gave the lad a taste of homelife and I am sure the love your Gran gave comforted him in the end.

Become a regular on the page, Calum. Its fun.

[Kojak]

I always think of my grandfather, who none of us ever knew. He's still in Flanders somewhere, but all we have is a name on the D.L.I. memorial at Ypres....

[Adriana]

I am always appalled when I hear young people refer to the two World Wars as 'boring' and 'irrelevant' - it is so easy to forget those who gave up their youth so that today's youngsters may enjoy theirs.

[Dave]

Thank you, Calum, for sharing that story. Very moving, even through the generations.
A strange country, that warfare in any theatre in any era - they all have their extremes of conditions, and are fought by ordinary people.

That pop-song -"Nineteen" summed it up in an inconsequential way. However, if you ever doubt that warfare is a young man's game, then look at any gravestones of any nationality of any war !
I noticed Adrianna's comment about the young thinking that it's irrelevant and boring. The eighteen year old student in sixth form, the 19 to 20 year old in University can hold that thought to their hearts if that is their belief - but, throughout the generations, it's their "contemporaries" that died/are dying.
And for what ? An acre of land ? A political posture ? Megalomania ? It's enough to make you spit flames !
...... come with me through the subsequent times to see the sheer bloody pointlessness since 1945.
The Cold War, Korea, Suez, Malaya, Cyprus, The Greek Civil War, Borneo, Aden, Viet-nam, Kuwait in the sixties, Aden, .....christ, my fingers are hurting typing this and I'm not out of the sixties yet.
What was that protest song ? "When will they ever learn?"

A small nation like UK has had only one year since 1945 that there has been no death on active service - 60 sodding years. (That was 1968 - and I doubt the total accuracy of that ! )
Still, never mind anyway, Westminster - praise the Lord, pass the ammuntion and open another box of soldiers ..... we've used these up. And don't worry about the (Americanism alert) "collateral damage" - well, they don't have a vote !

[CalumLincoln]

Thanks for the welcome folks.

Kojak, my grandfather on my mothers side founght at both the Somme and Ypres. I grew up with him talking a little about what happened there and he always said he would have liked to go back and see the place again and how much it would have changed. Unfortunately, money was not so plentiful in those days and he never got the chance to re-visit.

In 2005 my family and I were in Brugge and took a conducted day tour of the WW1 battlefields, trenches etc and the city of Ypres. The tour guide explained that if anyone had a special place they wished to visit, somethere that was personal to them, he would do his best to fit it in. I explained about my grandfather and that I'd like to visit the battlefield at Ypres. He then asked me which one? For some daft reason I thought there was only one there.

The tour guide told me that I should contact the War Records Divison at Kew in London as they hold about 50% of the WW1 soldiers war records and if his was there it would show in detail exactly where and when he fought, reports from officers about him, his times in hospital (he was wounded), and a lot more besides. It seems only 50% of the records remain as the rest were destroyed during WW2 bombing.

Just a thought, but if you want to find out more about your grandfather's war that might be the place to start

Regards,

Calum

[Kojak]

Thanks for that Calum. My brother, who is the Family Tree fiend of the family dug up some records which showed my grandfather being listed as missing in action. I'll pass the info on to him

[Oor Willie]

Dave I agree entirely and have tried to impress on my sons, both in their twenties,the importance of remembering past wars and hopefully trying to prevent new ones by not supporting the war makers.
As a member of a folk group I regularly sing the songs of Eric Boggle, No Mans Land, and The Band Played Waltzing Matilda.As I have lost no relatives during any of conflicts of the last 100 years or so I think of the words of these songs during the 2 minutes silence and I usualy have tears rolling down my face by the end of it.
I even find that in rehearsal it is difficult to get through these songs without breaking up, I need the adrenalin rush of a live performance to overcome the emotions and get the message across.

[Joanie]

Do your sons agree with you.Your lucky not to have lost anyone in the wars.It is very emotional during the 2mins silence.By the way Willie my brother is also a folk singer up in the North East has been for 40yrs or so.You may have met him sometime on your travels.Ithink he sometimes sings with the Keelers,and The High Level Ranters

[Oor Willie]

Hi Joanie, Yes I think the boys both agree with me as so far I have seen no signs to the contrary. As far as the folk singing goes I only do it as a hobby and we only perform in our local area so I have never met your brother but I ave heard of both of the groups you mention

[Ozzie Geoff]

This thread has prompted me to seek out an old book. it is the 1913 edition of "The Man From Snowy River and other verses" by A.B.(Banjo) Paterson.
In very strong handwriting on the fly leaf is my Grans inscription;
Lawrence Clifford Chatfield
11th Battalion
Killed in action at Bullecourt
May 6th. 1917

After reading Ben Elton's "The First Casualty" I am convinced more than ever that it was indeed "the war to end all wars".
Do try to seek the book out at your local library or book store.